Acknowledgement by the British head of state is proof enough the Downing Street Memo's exist!

Maybe a memo from "downing street" exists, but you have no idea what they really say. That doesn't matter to people like you who are obsessed with Bush. It's obvious because you are still complaining about what Bush did in the National Guard.

I blown that statement out of the water late last year or earlier this year. We had even pulled out his pay records to show that he did have a good year, even for retirement (i.e. there is no difference.) Do we have to dig up that old line/thread again? Bush did nothing against regs., you just have a problem with him using the upon "Commander's discretion" clause.

I don't think col remembers how he was proven wrong so many times about this. I think we are going to have to show him again.

Having a GOOD Retirement Year and maintaining flight status are two different things.

Yes they are 2 different things, but "you" keep trying to make them the same.

#27 by COL Gene Friday, July 01, 2005 ParaTed2K Wrong. Bush was a pilot in the Air Guard. In order to remain flight qualified, a flying office must attend twice as many drills than required for a "Good Retirement Year" When Bush did not attend drills during the second half of 1972 and did not take the required flight physical he was grounded. Thus, Bush was unable to fulfill the job he had in the Air Gurad - Fly high performance aircraft. He also missed a major training exercise that included his Air Guard unit in Oct 1972. What was Bush doing when he did not attend required drills? Runing a political campaign!

Imagine that.....proven wrong yet again!

drmiler

I am not the one saying a Good Retirement year and attending the drills needed to maintain flight qualifications are the same. The defense made for Bush not attending drills for 6 months in 1972 is that he had drilled earlier that enabled him to have a "Good Retirement year". He did have enough drills for retirement BUT NOT TO MAINTAIN FLIGHT QUALIFICATION - the reasons he was in the Air Guard. He then did not take a required flight physical and was grounded and could not fly. He then applied for an 8 month early release after being grounded for not following Air Force Regulations and was granted an "Early Honorable discharge" I wonder how that happened?

Colon Gene, even if your lies were true, guess what, he got an HONORABLE DISCHARGE!! Guess what, even if your lies were true, THAT WAS 33 YEARS AGO!!! Even if your lies were true, they have no bearing on anything happening today!

I proudly served with many great troops who I'd never vote for if they ran for president. On the other hand, I helped drum out a few guys who I would happily vote for if they chose to run. They weren't bad people, just never adapted well to military life.

Prs. Bush himself said that Sen. Kerry's service was much more exemplary than his own.

My recommendation to you is to GET A LIFE and quit living in 1972!!!

ParaTed2k

The military records of Bush prove everything I said is true. Yes 33 years ago Bush got an HONORABLE DICSHARGE the same way he got into the guard and that same way he was not held accountable for disobaying requlations-- Whth the help of Daddy and his powerful friends. You may think time changes all that. I DO NOT!

The military records of Bush prove everything I said is true. Yes 33 years ago Bush got an HONORABLE DISCHARGE the same way he got into the guard and that same way he was not held accountable for disobeying regulations-- With the help of Daddy and his powerful friends. You may think time changes all that. I DO NOT!

Your right, time changes nothing! So in light of that, even more time will NOT change Bush's "honorable discharge"! How you perceive that he got it is immaterial is it not? The fact remains that he has one. What do you hope to acomplish by running this into the ground? Do you think they'll take the honorable discharge away from him? Do you think they'll change the status of his discharge? Don't hold your breath! And BTW start running a spell checker. You need the help.

When Bush stands in front of our military giving speechs, the American people should know that when it was HIS TURN, he did not act the way we expect our military to act today. It is hipocritical of Bush to stand in front of our brave military when he disobayed the orders he was given (his failure to attend drills to maintain flight qualification and failure to take the physical that resulted in him being grounded) when it was his time to serve! When he flaunts his "Honorable Discharge" which he DID NOT DESERVE it is ths last straw! If Bush had been treated like other members of the Guard and Reserve that failed to follow regulations or attend drills, he would have been punished and would not be Commander-in Chief TODAY! He has set the worst possible example for the Commander-in-Chief - His Failure to obey his orders and regulations when he served in the military.

One basic distinction between bush and others who did not go to Vietnam is that while he avoided the draft by gaining access to the Champagne Guard, or whatever it was called, he supported that war. He didn't even have the integrity to be honest about himself. And, he couldn't even fulfill that obligation. Cheney also dodged the draft, using deferments, and remember, he had "better things to do." Yet, he too, also supported that quagmire. Again, integrity be damned.

On the other hand, Clinton, who people also rail about avoiding the draft, did so without ever giving others some false pretense. He was a Rhodes Scholar. He was a smart man. He used whatever he could to stay out of Vietnam. But, he never maintained that he concurrently supported that fiasco, the way our present day bozos did. He had, at least, that level of integrity. Of course, those who hated his politics used whatever they could to attempt to bring him down. All they came up with, and failed, was that he lied about a blow job. And yes, he likely was a snake in the marital sense. But, that was between him and Hillary.

Dubya still lies like a rug about his past. He lies like a rug about his present. He lies like a rug to make people believe he's some kind of saint coming to save the Mideast day. I really believe that he could care less about the mideast. He attempted to use war to bolster his ratings. He used war to solidify an oil reserve for the US. And, he used intellegence that was good, in a way that misrepresented that intelligence to dupe Americans into believing that the intelligence was "faulty". There was nothing faulty about that intelligence. In fact, they were firing anyone on staff who didn't wrap the intelligence around the neocon policy. Americans are finally seeing the light. Only the JUers and a other die-hard conservatives hang their collective hats on his foibles, follies and felonies. His numbers are indeed plummeting, whether you like it or not.

Bush is a war president, all right. But, he's going to go down in history as starting the war for selfish gains. In fact, his "attempts" to make the world safer from terrorists is a dismal failure. He created an Iraqi training ground of terrorists, more so than Afghanistan ever was. He made the world a more dangerous place with his lies, and history will never forget what a traitorous scumbag he and his cronies really are. Ya'll better get used to that idea. That is the way it will go down, like it or not.

When Bush stands in front of our military giving speechs, the American people should know that when it was HIS TURN, he did not act the way we expect our military to act today. It is hipocritical of Bush to stand in front of our brave military when he disobayed the orders he was given (his failure to attend drills to maintain flight qualification and failure to take the physical that resulted in him being grounded) when it was his time to serve! When he flaunts his "Honorable Discharge" which he DID NOT DESERVE it is ths last straw! If Bush had been treated like other members of the Guard and Reserve that failed to follow regulations or attend drills, he would have been punished and would not be Commander-in Chief TODAY! He has set the worst possible example for the Commander-in-Chief - His Failure to obey his orders and regulations when he served in the military.

That must be why the military vote goes to Bush, and the military have a very high respect for Bush.

Bush is a war president, all right. But, he's going to go down in history as starting the war for selfish gains. In fact, his "attempts" to make the world safer from terrorists is a dismal failure. He created an Iraqi training ground of terrorists, more so than Afghanistan ever was. He made the world a more dangerous place with his lies, and history will never forget what a traitorous scumbag he and his cronies really are. Ya'll better get used to that idea. That is the way it will go down, like it or not.

The only lies are the one's in your post.

#38 by zinkadoodle Sunday, July 03, 2005 One basic distinction between bush and others who did not go to Vietnam is that while he avoided the draft by gaining access to the Champagne Guard, or whatever it was called, he supported that war. He didn't even have the integrity to be honest about himself. And, he couldn't even fulfill that obligation. Cheney also dodged the draft, using deferments, and remember, he had "better things to do." Yet, he too, also supported that quagmire. Again, integrity be damned. On the other hand, Clinton, who people also rail about avoiding the draft, did so without ever giving others some false pretense

Now try again!

Clinton's Military record: Bill Clinton registers for the draft on September 08, 1964, accepting all contractual conditions of registering for the draft. Given Selective Service Number 3 26 46 228. Bill Clinton classified 2-S on November 17, 1964. * Bill Clinton reclassified 1-A on March 20, 1968. * Bill Clinton ordered to report for induction on July 28,1969. * Bill Clinton dishonors order to report and is not inducted into the military. * Bill Clinton reclassified 1-D after enlisting in the United States Army Reserves on August 07,1969 under authority of Col.E.Holmes. and takes oath of enlistment. * Bill Clinton fails to report to his duty station at the University of Arkansas ROTC, September 1969. * Bill Clinton reclassified 1-A on October 30, 1969, as enlistment with Army Reserves is revoked by Colonel E. Holmes and Clinton now AWOL and subject to arrest under Public Law 90-40 (2)(a) 'registrant who has failed to report...remain liable for induction'. * Bill Clinton's birth date lottery number is 311, drawn December 1, 1969, but anyone who has already been ordered to report for induction, is INELIGIBLE! * Bill Clinton runs for Congress (1974), while a fugitive from justice under Public Law 90-40. * Bill Clinton runs for Arkansas Attorney General (1976),while a fugitive from justice. * Bill Clinton receives pardon on January 21, 1977 from Carter. * Bill Clinton FIRST PARDONED FEDERAL FELON ever to serve as President. All these facts come from Freedom of Information requests, public laws, and various books that have been published, and have not been refuted by Clinton. Aside from an improper application of public law, the events outlined above are basically correct, at least until the author draws the fallacious conclusion that Clinton was a criminal for his actions. A complete account of Clinton's elaborate draft-dodge is given in the reference cited below, but the gist is this: Eighteen-year old Bill enters Georgetown University and registers for Selective Service, as required by law. His status as a full-time student earns him a deferrment. In his senior year, Bill receives a Rhodes Scholarship to study at Oxford University. In February of 1968, the Federal Government eliminates draft deferments for graduate students and Bill once again becomes eligible in March of that year. Clinton subsequently, though family and political connections, obtains a Navy Billet from the local naval reserve unit and temporary draft protection from the Garland County Draft Board, allowing him to start at Oxford - special treatment that was not uncommon for Rhode's Scholars of the day. Clinton completes his first term at Oxford in December, 1969, and is ordered to report for a physical in January, which he did. In April 1969, Bill was ordered to report for induction. However, delays in International mail delivery resulted in Clinton receiving his orders after the induction date had passed. By this time, he had begun his second term at Oxford. Regulations allowed him to complete the term, but he must report for induction by July 28, 1969. Once again utilizing extensive political connections, Clinton gets accepted into the University of Arkansas ROTC program on July 17, nullifying his draft notice. Clinton would not have to enroll until he completed basic training the following year. In the fall of '69, Clinton opts to return to Oxford, rather than enroll in the University of Arkansas Law School. While at Oxford, Clinton contacts the draft board to drop his ROTC deferment and return to active status. By this time, regulations had changed, allowing graduate students to complete their schooling before reporting for military duty. Clinton had a high enough draft number to virtually ensure he would not be called.

When Bush stands in front of our military giving speechs, the American people should know that when it was HIS TURN, he did not act the way we expect our military to act today. It is hipocritical of Bush to stand in front of our brave military when he disobayed the orders he was given (his failure to attend drills to maintain flight qualification and failure to take the physical that resulted in him being grounded) when it was his time to serve! When he flaunts his "Honorable Discharge" which he DID NOT DESERVE it is ths last straw! If Bush had been treated like other members of the Guard and Reserve that failed to follow regulations or attend drills, he would have been punished and would not be Commander-in Chief TODAY! He has set the worst possible example for the Commander-in-Chief - His Failure to obey his orders and regulations when he served in the military.

You STILL don't get it do you? All you whining and complaining accomplishes what????? NOTHING! You will NOT convince anyone to change the status of his discharge, OR take it away from him. What *YOU* personally feel he deserves or does not deserve is IMMATERIAL! He has it. Case closed! And whether or not you like it, he IS the Commander in Chief of our military. And as such issues what "he" considers to be the correct orders. NOT what you consider to be correct! Like I've said before, he's IN until 2008! DEAL WITH IT!

What is important is that people interested in the truth know that Bush is a foney and his military service a is a joke!

The military records of Bush prove everything I said is true. Yes 33 years ago Bush got an HONORABLE DICSHARGE the same way he got into the guard and that same way he was not held accountable for disobaying requlations-- Whth the help of Daddy and his powerful friends. You may think time changes all that. I DO NOT!

I wonder Colon Gene. Does your absolutely useless hatred keep you warm at night? It is this kind of stupidity that ruled this last election cycle and made it a mockery.

The Election of the Two LTs. A Senator who apparently couldn't run on his senate record and a bunch of his supporters who couldn't find anything worse to say about Prs. Bush than what he did or didn't do 33 years ago.

When Prs. Clinton's draft dodging was exposed, he was still elected president. Everyone and their dogtags had already heard all the crap about Prs. Bush.

When it was all said and done, the only thing that those things did was bring down the idiots who actually thought this country is still fighting the Vietnam war.

The country moved on in the 80s. I guess you were too scared to actually live in the present to see that.

Welcome to the 21st Century Colon Gene. It's not too late to join us. The music may not be as good, but most other things are much better. ;~D

What is important is that people interested in the truth know that Bush is a foney and his military service a is a joke!

You know for someone that's supposed to be so intelligent you should learn how to spell. The word is "phony" not foney. No what "is" important is exactly what was in my reply. NO ONE cares if "you think" GW is a "phony" or whether or not you think his service was a joke. OR what "you" perceive to be the truth.